yeah, I'm sure the Dutch are stupid enough to close down their billion dollar a year tourist trade by banning them from buying cannabis. Why else do they think people visit Amsterdam? The food? The customer service? LOL.

By silverhaze | September 9, 2009 10:16 AM

They are also shutting down many "windows" in the RedLight.. Putting fashion maniquins in place of real girls. No. It's true. I live in Holland.

By RDDS | September 9, 2009 10:36 AM

Hey Silverhaze. its ok Amsterdam has such lovely Museums which as we all know is the real reason people go there. They just use the cannabis as a perfect cover story so as not to seem too nerdy. Ha Ha Ha stupid government.

By Langer | September 9, 2009 11:16 AM

The only reason that organised crime gets involved is because they didnt make it completely legal in the first place. If it was completely legal and open to protection from the police there would be absolutley no organised crime involved.

By Mass | September 9, 2009 12:29 PM

-
It is rather odd, but one can appreciate the pressure being placed on our Xtian political parties by their good EuroParl-party buddies in Belgium/Germany and in France.

It is rather odd too, that the term 'organised crime' is applied. Let's face facts: 1) cannabis is an illegal, controlled substance in the Netherlands unless it is a medical product as retailed by pharmacies and prescribed by a physician. 2) By a State Directive to the DPP (District Public Prosecutor), by decree, no person will be arrested and processed in the criminal system for possessing less than <5 grams. 3) This legal means (the way in which the substance is "ge-controleerd" {translation into Eng = "supervised"}) saves much police wo/man hours in paperwork and prevents citizens from having a slur on their personal international passport documentation - for ever and ever. As a substance, however, this is ‘supervision’ nonetheless. 4) There are a plethora of federal regulations applying to all owners of coffee shops where cannabis is retailed. If owners break these, they are forcibly shut-down by City Hall.

All this actually "requires" owners of coffee shops to be ‘highly-organised’ and established businesses.

The very fact that coffee-shop owners are required by law to pay a "turnover tax" on the business that they conduct, also and equally require those proprietors to be ‘highly-organised’.

Those foreign politicians placing pressure-upon-pressure on the Dutch politiqué had better take a look at their own jurisdictions. In many of our neighbouring member-states of the Union, heavy-handed approach to the simple possession of soft-drugs effects a number of significant consequences.
1) Youths processed for offences under such legislation are potentially placed on the highroad to criminal future for simple misdemeanours of those states' criminal codes [once branded a criminal it is no longer possible to have such removed from one's (internationally accessible) Schengen Information System dossier].
2) All those who wish to seek out cannabis products (prevalent in all young adult populations in the Union) are forced to enter the underworld of 'drugs' : and thereby come into contact with 'flying column' retailers of other, stronger, more damaging, controlled-substances such as amphetamines, cocaine, heroin et al.
3) Young adults in prohibitionist member-states who are, more often than not, young students or youths making their career-choices and who desire to seek out their first experience with cannabis products, must search for hours and hours seeking out their illicit products in shadier parts of their towns & cities. This is a waste of valuable time that could otherwise be spent completing their studies, résumés, filling in job-applications or playing sports and keeping fit and healthy.

Society is not going to put a halt on young adults desires to experience certain human behaviours and experiences, that is blatantly obvious. However, the Netherlands' State directive to the DPP not to process adults for small amounts provides for a situation where those desires on the part of adults to behave in a given manner minimises the chance that they must come into direct contact with retailers of narcotics of all descriptions. This is an important, often overlooked, fact.
---
So, where is this all coming from?
The image of Amsterdam, in particular, has come under a renewed attack from certain international media interests in the United States at an increased fervour ever since (and immediately preceding) the elections of a Democrat President there.
The capital city, of all capital cities, world renowned for being founded upon the spirit of freedom-of-thought in philosophy, being a meritocracy, religious tolerance during a time of severe religious persecution where tolerance was in short-supply, and one of excellence in the arts is certainly not “all that”, which is perceived through TV screens the world over.

Because here, at home, it’s quite a different story. For example, among its fellow 12 semi-independent united Netherlands Provinces - it is the one city that in terms of repute one could almost say is the thirteenth province of the Netherlands simply because of its over exposure abroad and overseas. Thirteen, being the number that it is, could have something to do with its misfortune for being singled-out, for example, by United States republican political-forces to exemplify where the would-be liberal agenda of the new American president will eventually lead the United States and her peoples. In my own opinion, many of those reports would be downright libellous had Amsterdam its own personage.
And all that woe and hot-air, when Amsterdam isn't 'even' the capital of the Netherlands' Province in which it is situate -- the capital city of the Province of North-Holland being actually Haarlem.

Fox News reports on US networks (from News Corp Inc.) like the Bill O'Reilly Report typify this most recent, worrying development.

If one watches closely the national elections-campaigns, politico-histories and track-records of many of the foreign media outlets that are currently relishing in ever-invigorated anti-Amsterdam campaigns; one will note that record as being one of supporting conservatism and (generally) the right-wing of their political apparatuses. As a mere trimming on the overall, national, anti-liberal campaign (mind you and remember: in their own jurisdictions) a falsely portrayed and distorted image of this great nation’s capital city is presented galore.
Netherlands politicians should stay above this alien divisiveness in foreigner politics and in the foreigners’ societies where those divisive dialogues are taking place.
It is really something quite remarkable though : that an unashamedly false portrayal of their own capital by certain powerful media corporations (but, of course, in the English language) would carry away the politique and electorate; and, instead of continuing, have them all set a new course for the society here to follow. It just goes to show one the power of big-media nowadays despite increased media-access among the general population. And it also shows the lack of understanding of foreign countries communications landscapes among the native Dutch politique. Finally it somewhat hints at an over-reliance on foreign thought and perception required by the native Dutch to validate their own society, in their own minds and on their lips. Yes, in their own minds : because practically things are quite alright relatively speaking to situations in our neighbouring member-states.

Netherlands is doing fine without all that, and she moreover does not need the foreigner-press who have little understanding of, and care even less about, the society as it is here to be shouting over their picket fences and brandishing their big, thick-knuckled, clenched-fists from far away, across the water.
---

By Noel McCullagh | September 9, 2009 1:02 PM

Other EU countries are against the Dutch governments soft drug policies, and always trying to persuade the EU to take hard line action. This is due to jealousy & ignorance, but mostly intolerance. allowing soft drugs would put thousands of police officers out of a job, including expensive spy satellites, courts and criminal lawyers. It all has to do with control.

By stevie | September 9, 2009 1:47 PM

If it ain't broke, don't fix it...

This will lead to more street dealing and introduce the need for more police as well leading to criminal records for trivial offences for people who wouldn't have got one in the past. Of course there will also be a reduction in tourism. The reputation (at least from abroad) of The Netherlands and especially Amsterdam as a liberal, tolerant place is slowly being eroded.

But then, what else can we expect when the Christians are in charge?

By Mark | September 9, 2009 3:20 PM

It IS all about control. Here in the United States, There is such resistance to total decriminalization of marijuana because so many police and prison personnel will have to find "REAL" productive work instead of gov't sinecures. Marijuana will grow almost anywhere, under a wide range of conditions; it is ubiquitous and beneficial, yet the powers that be seek to control it.

By Decurion_505 | September 9, 2009 3:32 PM

Here in Berlin, there's a park nearby where lots of Africans hang out all day, no matter the weather, in several locations at least 12 hours a day, selling marijuana.

A few times a month the police do a kind of sweep, usually in huge marked fans (sometimes in unmarked cars, driving too fast in the park, etc.).

These guys have no proper place to sit, no rain cover, no toilet closeby (joggers and others also cr-p outside)... stupid national government could be making money off of this, give these guys - who are after all doing a service - some dignity.. stupid dysfunctional Germany society.

In the meantime the local ordungsamt. busts dogs for being offleash...

By Todd | September 9, 2009 3:38 PM

Noel,

It's time for you and other progressives to get over Bill O'Reilly's short report about Amsterdam. I don't see why you let him get you all bent out of shape and can only conclude that it's part of an ongoing attempt to tear down Fox News and O'Reilly.

I highly doubt that the Dutch gov't is reacting to Fox News, O'Reilly, etc. How silly to think that such a strong consensus government would resort to this. Rather, it's the EU that is forcing most of the changes about Dutch drug policy.

I LOVE Amsterdam, lived there for many years and saw the flaws in that report (watched it on YouTube with plenty of opposing commentary about everything that was said), but there is no point obsessing about it . . . unless there is some other agenda in play.

O'Reilly has his good moments and bad moments. So does every other TV personality. Look closer to home for the main cause of the changes.

By Janice | September 9, 2009 4:16 PM

another reason religious zealots should NEVER be in power, legalize it now

By adhd | September 9, 2009 4:26 PM

Stop turning a blind Eye? What happened to Amsterdam? "Poep op the stoep" is still shit on the sidewalk. No matter what you call it.

I suppose some people think it is better to be blind in both eyes. Then to see things how they really are.

Decrease crime? DEMAND DOES NOT DECREASE just because society finds something distasteful, especially in Amsterdam with it's constant influx of tourists. I already know what will happen. The tourists will be buying their joints off every hustler in town, especially in Amsterdam. I am a hundred percent certain this will increase drug street sales and organized crime.

By Sean Cody | September 9, 2009 5:31 PM

the Netherlands should continue to stick to her own identity as a liberal and tolerant country. I`ve lived there before and I can say confidently that it`s far more orderly than most EU countries

By Dada | September 9, 2009 5:48 PM

i completely quote mass: they should legalize completely production if what they want to do is really to fight crime. All of us who live in the Netherlands have seen ambiguous people around coffe shops. If you allow people to grow it and coffe shops to produce it legally you would have the following benefits:
-better quality and less chemical substances in your weed
-1/10th prices (how can one gram of a normal plant cost 7.5 euro???)comeon, it can be grown everywhere from nepal to maroc
-huge damage to organized crime
-MUCH HIGHER INCOME FOR THE STATE AND THEREFORE BENEFIT FOR ALL TAXPAYERS

unfortunately i suspect it is only a moralistic move..

By Ferlo | September 9, 2009 5:54 PM

One of the smartest things the Dutch have ever done is decriminalise marijuana. Here's hoping these plans fall through.

By Chi | September 9, 2009 7:15 PM

Like the saying goes, it is almost impossible to break age long tradition.
The pressure on Netherlands can only get better if they remain firm with their policies in place. Control of this soft drug is the best way ever of dealing with it, if not it will cost them more than they ever expect to stop it entirely.

By Dallas | September 9, 2009 8:25 PM

Mass is exactly right. The law in the NL is upside down. Possession and coffee shops legal but cultivation and distribution illegal??? The government has created opportunity for organized crime with this inconsistency.

By Mark | September 9, 2009 9:03 PM

I like Noel McCullagh's comment descriptive.
I dropped into Amsterdam for a little stop on my way to see my relative.
i was harassed by a man following me trying to sell me drugs on the street.
I thought why would I want to buy from a stranger when I knew I could stop in a cafe.

By Ronaldmartens | September 9, 2009 11:45 PM

I strongly doubt this will effect any of the major cities where tourism is a large part of the economy. Fact is, money talks. Amsterdam, Den Haag, Rotterdam, and to a lesser extent Haarlem, Utrecht, etc. likely won't see this take effect. I'd wager it's going to be a city by city deal, and the smaller cities that are having the biggest issues along the boarders with the French, Belgian and Germans who just hop on over to buy some pot.

While there are more reasons than sex and weed people come to Amsterdam and Holland in general, to deny they are a major part of the economy is fool-hardy. No way is the government going to negatively financially impact so many people. Yes, they are toning down the Red-Light, but it's not going away. They may scale back some of the coffeeshops, close down some of the less reputable ones, but you aren't going to see the Dampkring's, the Barney's, the Cremers, the Green Houses get shut down, or made to require a fucking license. Not gonna happen.

By Shawn | September 10, 2009 12:40 AM

This will go the way of the extra high taxes at Schiphol airport. Once the realise the loss of all tourist revenue, this will fall flat on it's face.

How about other EU coutries re-think their cannabis policies?

Note: I am not a cannabis smoker.

By Quest | September 10, 2009 1:48 AM

I have visited Amsterdam and many cities in the Netherlands many many times over throughout the years because they were welcoming and freer than we are in America for the most part. Obviously, since Van Gogh's and Pym Fortuyn' deaths, the Dutch have shown and ugly side of intolerance and authoritarianism. I have spent 10's of thousands of dollars as a tourist over the last ten years, but now, thanks to their intolerance, I think I will take my dollars elsewhere. I hope the Dutch Foreign minister sees this because frankly his gov't is a bunch of shortsited fools that will cut off their own ears to spite their faces. Shame on you dutch government.

By Robert R. | September 10, 2009 3:45 AM

Maastricht of course. with this type of legislation the people of Maastricht will achieve their status of the most supreme human robots in the world. and no foreign influence will be allowed in this paradise of perfection. there must be some evil genius doing collective mind control experiments in this place. Projoct "Live Museum", VISITORS ARE NOT ALLOWED TO TUCH THE EXHIBITS

By Victor Malakovski | September 10, 2009 7:01 AM

I see. A Muslim emigrant from a third-world country, who is also a Dutch citizen or legal resident, gets a pass into coffeehouses. However he is not likely to appreciate the experience, given the puritanism of his religion. But a third-generation Dutch-American who happens to also be a tourist in Holland, is kept out of coffeehouses.

Of course organized crime will have an edge where the business in quesiton is illegal (as is the case with cannabis cultivation). The obvious solution is legalization of cultivation.

I would say we ought to require at least a 120 IQ for politicians, but that would probably also require a similar test for voters.

By kevin | September 10, 2009 7:41 AM

Yes, great idea, I mean nobody has any problems with truffles, er um, 'mushrooms' any more...

Yes, this is a great plan...

By Patrick Hayes | September 10, 2009 10:17 AM

YAY!!! No more drug tourists! This is great. Shut down the windows! Close the tourist-catering coffee shops! Amsterdam will be far better off without loud, drunk and stoned idiots stumbling all over the place, pissing on my doorstep every night!
We will still have plenty of tourism for our art, history, architecture etc., and they will be the kind of tourists who don't cause problems, and who have money.

By Amsterdammer | September 10, 2009 11:55 AM

Just reading all these comments says it all!

Prohibition of marijuana is fuel for a huge black market, criminality, a larger police force & an enormous loss in revenue & resources.

(There is more chance of renting a council property on the moon, than the abolition of marijuana prohibition.)

By stevie | September 10, 2009 2:11 PM

Amsterdammer, the majority of tourists to your country do NOT come to your country for the museums or the tulips or especially you money grubbing rudesness that passes off as hospitality. Go ahead and destroy your economy. There are many other countries (spain and Portugal to name a couple who would love to have my money. If you don't want loud and rowdy tourists pissing on your doorstep, ban voetbal (soccer in America) or ban the alcohol served at soccer games. It isn't the marijuana smokers that are pissing on your door step it is the drunks. Tell Pieter at the Pax hotel that his business is going to dry up because of your intolerance to those that bring major buck to your country. The dutch gov't has really made George Bush and his administration look like angels. The Netherlands is doomed to a fate of quickly becoming a backwater country filled with nazi-like yahoos running the country.

By Robert R. | September 10, 2009 2:57 PM

-
There are plenty of authors on this page, and so I am left to ponder why you address me specifically as though I was the author of this article, Janice. I’m flattered.

However, because you do address me in person, I shall reply to some of the points you raised.

This is the first time I've posted a reaction mentioning Mr O'Reilly of Fox News. I even cited his program incorrectly because I am not a regular viewer nor am I am in a jurisdiction where that program is aired. - as you seem to be. There's nothing for me to 'get over' as you put it. Thanks for your concern for my wellbeing all the same.
You state that I am all "bent out of shape" and attribute that to my having seen a YouTube video from Fox news. Forgive me if I am incorrect, but is this a pun on the fact that I am living with multiple sclerosis? Are you making some kind of attempt at humour? I'm not laughing Janice.

Nor am I making any ongoing attempt to tear down Fox News : I don't watch it, period.
In my post, I wrote 'for example', but that is not to preclude a wider picture of precisely the same inaccurate reporting elsewhere in media situate in various other countries. There are many other reports and in various languages; all just as inaccurate as that indicated in the example offered.

That the Dutch government is reacting to Fox News reports are your words, not mine. And I agree, it 'is' silly of you to do that.
The EU could very well be responsible for 'forcing most of the changes about Dutch drug policy' : but what is the EU, and who or what is the driving forces behind that? Do you think that this is as much an issue for Cyprus and Malta, as it is for France or ze Germans?

Are you an EU citizen? Do you speak Dutch, French, German or Flemish? [Just a hunch].

Glad you saw the YouTube video, but I am not impressed by your statement that I am obsessing about it. That's unfounded and it hurts me a great deal that you write that that is what I am doing.
What other agenda could be at play? It's your suggestion: what could that be? I'm sure that O'Reilly or whoever he is has his good and his bad moments : I cannot say because I am not an obsessive fan of his as you appear to be.

That I should look closer to home for the answer I find a total joke : and again, I am forced to ask whether you are purposely trying to taunt me with your scandalous remarks.

There is no way that I may return-to-home to look for 'for the main cause of the changes' : and that is because I am forbidden from ever entering my home precisely because of the ill-reputation portrayed in foreign, illiterate in Dutch, reports and press perceptions.

Of course, I don't expect you to know that; rather I'm telling you because I do not think I could take reading another crushing post of the variety that you have to deal out, Janice.

Whoever, & whereever, you are.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

National News - Sunday Independent 16 Aug 2009

'Exiled' MS patient risks arrest
-By John Whelan

A Irishman suffering from Multiple Sclerosis (MS) can't come home because his medication includes cannabis-based drugs.

Noel McCullagh, originally from Ballinasloe, Co Galway, has been told by the Irish authorities that he will be arrested if he attempts to bring his legally prescribed medication, Bediol and Bedrocan, prescribed in Holland, into Ireland.

The social inclusion unit of the HSE have told the 33-year-old that he will be arrested if he attempts to come home to his family for a visit with the medication.

But Noel McCullagh is adamant that he is not making a 'political football' of the issue; his life is at stake. Without the medication he is crippled with pain, at risk of convulsive seizures, and in danger of a deadly bout of encephalitis, which took the life of his baby sister Carmen.

Mr McCullagh, a journalist who lives in Holland, previously required a walking stick to get around, but thanks to his medication he now cycles everywhere, and he swims 2km a day.

Appeals to the Minister for Health, the HSE, and dozens of politicians of all persuasions have fallen on deaf ears.

"I have been inside the police cordon, with a television crew putting questions to Brian Cowen, while taking my medication in Brussels, but I wasn't allowed to come to Ireland to cover the Lisbon Treaty referendum," he says.

Mr McCullagh has charted every element of his battle with the Irish authorities to be allowed return home and visit his parents Michael (70) and Ann (66), in Ballinasloe, Co Galway.

"It is 1,104 days now, every night and every morning, three times Christmas, and three of my mother's birthdays. It is very distressing for me on an ongoing basis. It plays on my mind a lot.

"Three years ago, when I first got in contact with the Department of Health I was given the complete run-around and one official even said to me, 'can you not leave the Jamaican woodbines with the prossies in Amsterdam?'

"Even though this medication is prescribed and managed by my neurologist I'm still not welcome with it in Ireland," Mr McCullagh says.

"I want to be very clear that I am not campaigning for cannabis or the legalisation of cannabis. I am on the strongest cannabis ever engineered by man and it is only prescribed as a last resort alternative for people with Aids, cancer, chronic spinal injuries, Crohn's disease and MS. It's prescribed as a medicine and anyone who thinks there is some advantage in this should be careful what they wish for," he says.

Replying to a parliamentary question from Joe Costello TD on January 27 this year, Minister of Health Mary Harney said: "As the law currently stands, however, it would not be possible for a cannabis extract to be licensed here for medicinal use or for a doctor to prescribe it.

"There are no exemptions or exceptions applicable. Any person entering the country with medicinal cannabis could be charged under the Misuse of Drugs Act with unauthorised possession and I do not intend to change the law in this regard."

This week a spokesman for the Department of Health reiterated the minister's position as set out in the Dail.

"Currently, cannabis is included in Schedule 1 of the Misuse of Drugs Act as it is regarded as having no medicinal use and its possession, sale, importation etc is prohibited -- not by Social Inclusion Unit -- but by the law of the land. The Department of Justice has responsibility on the Schengen issue," according to the Health Department spokesman.

- JOHN WHELAN
Permalink: http://bit.ly/1awzu3
==========================

By Noel McCullagh | September 10, 2009 3:20 PM

Closing down shops will not eliminate loud, drunk, stoned idiots pissing on your doorstep. We have plenty of those people in NYC and we don't have coffeeshops, however, we do have bars. Is the Netherlands planning to prohibit alcohol too?

I've been to Amsterdam six times, and yes, I enjoy smoking cannabis without fear, and being treated as a customer, not a criminal.

The day Amsterdam closes its coffeeshops is the day the country loses something unique and special.

The rest of the world should be more like Amsterdam, not Amsterdam becoming like the rest of the world, that is: less free, spending money to persecute non-violent pot smokers.

By RaisinToastie | September 10, 2009 3:36 PM

Do the Netherlands wish to continue as an Mj.tourist destination?With Mexico gearing up for the eightball junket onslaught and the dissapearance of a great deal of the American market.Seems a more open, tourist friendlier plan would support revenues better. Amsterdam is no longer the only game in town.

By Lee | September 10, 2009 5:08 PM

Wait till you see how the English tourists are without the calming effect of cannabis. Full on, loud, drunk and aggressive. Your only hope is that they won't bother coming as they can get whores and beer elsewhere. They certainly aren't interested in the Culture

By Deano | September 10, 2009 5:25 PM

This is complete lunacy and to me this type of mentality does not have the best interest of the civilian population. It is just allowing the bad guys to get re-gain a stronger foothold, DOOOOOOOOOOHHHHH

san diego California DA dumanis and the board of supervisors are equally insane as they continue to stall and make up reasons to keep busting med pot distributors, despite what the voters have said.

and the fact there is already a set of guidelines established state wide. Same old argument, increase crime, neighbor hood is becoming worse, and most of the time it is nothing more than rhetorical nonsense.

Counties across the state continue to ban med pot stores, and city and county cops continue to assist feds although it is against the Cal constitution.

We are being attacked and it will never stop as long as these holier than though types don't put the complete picture together or care too. Which I doubt.

Thanks you randolph hearst, may you rot in hell.

Noel, good on ya buddy and keep up the battle, total bs. Doesn't Ireland have some serious problems with bad guys that move weed?

By penit | September 12, 2009 6:40 AM

LOL. This is up near the top of dumbest ideas ever for their administrators. Consideration of losing BILLIONS of euros worth of tourism due to pot-tourism. Who says no to that much money, honestly?
Do they actually think it would DECREASE crime? LOL. Just look at USA and their utterly failing drug war. Leave cannabis alone. If you want to go after hard drugs, fine, but leave marijuana alone.
Also, making it legal for only dutch citizens to visit them is against the law. They cannot do that. It would not hold in court at all. They could PERHAPS forbid non-EU citizens from going to the shops, but now that NL is part of EU, they could never legally forbid other EU member citizens for going to the shops.
LEAVE THE COFFEE SHOPS ALONE, FOR PETE's SAKE!

By tim D. | September 12, 2009 5:03 PM

What a truly disappointing proposal. I hope that the Dutch people will recognize that this is not the way to reduce the problems that are perceived or real under current law. If the government thinks it has problems with organized crime now, imagine what the problem will become when tourists are forced to break the law and rely upon the black market for a couple of doobies. Makes me want to spend my time and money someplace else. (I vacation to the Netherlands twice each year and spend nearly US $5,000 per visit on hotels, rental cars, restaurants, museums and yes, coffee shops.)

By Dakota | September 13, 2009 5:00 AM

What a shame the way Holland is going. For years I have been an avid visitor to Holland and have very much admired their attitudes to marijuana, sexuality, religous freedom etc. but this is now all going away. Instead the country is not being run by the Dutch anymore it seems, but by their German soft fascist neighbours. It seems to me that the Germans, will never be happy until they make very country in Europe, especially Holland, enforce every rule and regulation they have which believe me are thousands of them.They do it under the guise of the European Community, which is a new German controlled soft fascist state. They will not be happy until every country is as boring as Germany, and its citizens just as docile. It seems to me that Germany did finally win the war in the end. Shame on Holland and I hope that Amsterdam and all the other pot selling cities go bust. What do ouy think tourists go there for anyway? The great hospitality or the over priced micro beers. Give me a break!

By Albert R | September 13, 2009 2:42 PM

The only reason to visit Amsterdam is th lax drug laws. I'll visit somewhere else, the search is on for the next best place if they inact there laws.

By S Atkinson | September 13, 2009 6:27 PM